I'm surprised no one brought this up (trav), but the questions the soldier drilled Rumsfeld with about the armored Humvees were planted by a reporter from Chatnooga who is embedded in that troops division in Iraq.
<font size="3">U.S. soldiers take complaints to new level</font>
<font size="1">Critics of Iraq war see breakdown of troop morale
The Associated Press
Updated: 4:54 p.m. ET Dec. 10, 2004</font>
WASHINGTON - Soldiers always gripe. But confronting the defense secretary, filing a lawsuit over extended tours and refusing to go on a mission because it?s too dangerous elevate complaining to a new level.
It also could mean a deeper problem for the Pentagon: a lessening of faith in the Iraq mission and in a volunteer army that soldiers can?t leave.
The hubbub over an exchange between Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld and soldiers in Kuwait has given fresh ammunition to critics of the Bush administration?s Iraq policy.
It also highlighted growing morale and motivation problems in the 21-month-old war that even some administration supporters say must be addressed to get off a slippery slope that could eventually lead to breakdowns reminiscent of the Vietnam War.
Tip of the iceberg?
For thousands of years, soldiers have grumbled about everything from their commanders to their equipment to shelter and food. But challenging a defense secretary to his face is rare. So is suing the military to keep from being sent back to a combat zone.
?We are seeing some unprecedented things. The real fear is that these could be tips of a larger iceberg,? said P.J. Crowley, a retired colonel who served as a Pentagon spokesman in both Republican and Democratic administrations and was a White House national security aide in the Clinton administration.
?The real issue is not any one of these things individually. It?s what the broader impact will be on our re-enlistment rates and our retention,? Crowley said.
Several Iraq-bound soldiers confronted Rumsfeld on Wednesday at a base in Kuwait about a lack of armor for their Humvees and other vehicles, about second-hand equipment and about a policy keeping many in Iraq far beyond enlistment contracts. Their pointed questions were cheered by others in the group.
The episode ? the questions and Rumsfeld?s testy responses were captured by television cameras and widely reported ? did not raise new issues. Complaints about inadequate protection against insurgents? roadside bombs and forced duty extensions have been sounded for months. But not so vividly.
Assurances from the president
President Bush and Rumsfeld offered assurances that the issues of armor and equipment were being dealt with, and that the plainspoken expression of concerns by soldiers was welcome.
?I?d want to ask the defense secretary the same question,? Bush said, if the president were a soldier in overseas combat. ?They deserve the best,? he added.
The display of brazenness in Kuwait came just two days after eight U.S. soldiers in Kuwait and Iraq filed a lawsuit challenging the military?s ?stop loss? policy, which allows the extension of active-duty deployments during times of war or national emergencies.
In October, up to 19 Army reservists from a unit based in South Carolina refused orders to drive unarmored trucks on a fuel supply mission along attack-prone roads near Baghdad, contending it was too dangerous. The Pentagon is still investigating the incident.
Force structure in question
?Tensions obviously are rising,? said Anthony Cordesman, a military analyst at the Center for Strategic and International Studies and a former adviser to Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz.
?The fact is that you do need now to consider how to change the force structure: the role of the reserves, the role of the actives. Troops are being deployed in continuing combat under what are often high risk conditions for far longer periods than anyone had previously considered or planned for.?
When the war began in March 2003, the troops were predominantly active duty military. Today, National Guard and Army Reserve units make up about 40 percent of the force.
The growing restiveness of U.S. troops in the Middle East echoes a drop in optimism at home that a stable, democratic government can be established in Iraq. A new poll for The Associated Press by Ipsos-Public Affairs shows that 47 percent of Americans now think it?s likely Iraq can establish such a government, down from 55 percent in April.
White House spokesman Scott McClellan on Friday said that Bush ?is committed to making sure our troops have the best equipment and all the resources they need to do their jobs. And that?s exactly what he expects to happen.?
URL: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6694376/
I'm surprised no one brought this up (trav), but the questions the soldier drilled Rumsfeld with about the armored Humvees were planted by a reporter from Chatnooga who is embedded in that troops division in Iraq.
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Well, at least some of the questions were prompted by a reporter but so what? If they weren't valid and of real concern the soldiers (yes plural) wouldn't have asked them. By the way did you hear the actual event with all the soldiers cheering when the questions were asked?Originally posted by reason:
I'm surprised no one brought this up (trav), but the questions the soldier drilled Rumsfeld with about the armored Humvees were planted by a reporter from Chatnooga who is embedded in that troops division in Iraq.
The reason the reporter "planted" the questions was due to Rumsfeld refusing to take questions from the press. He was obviously trying for another captive audience, staged event that the Rove misinformation team is so adroit at managing.
Also did you know that one of the companies that does the armoring for the army's vehicles has been trying to get bush boy to uparmor more vehicles for months as they are running below capacity but the pentagon declined thier offer?
Oh, and here's a quote from Rummy trying to explain:"I don't know what the facts are, but somebody's certainly going to sit down with him [Wilson] and find out what he knows that they may not know, and make sure he knows what they know that he may not know, and that's a good thing."
What the fuck!?! The man has made babbling an art form.
Here's a great response to the charge that a reporter assisted in framing that question.
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">It doesn?t matter if the question concerning lack of adequate armor had been written on a hairball hocked up by a cat at Rumfeld?s feet. What matters is the validity of the claim that such armor protection is lacking and the quality of Rumsfeld?s response.
Source: Carl Luna's blog
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I really like your sig Lan. Great stuff.Originally posted by LanDroid:
His sig
I don't see why there is a problem. If you send people over to die, at least let them die with the best equipment.
I should add a third quote to my sig - one from the debates where Bush denies saying Osama is not a priority. Gotta work on that...
<font color="#a52a2a" size="1">[ December 11, 2004 11:36 PM: Message edited by: LanDroid ]</font>
There we go, that's better... [img]graemlins/smarty.gif[/img] But ya gotta scroll up to see it, the board posts sigs only once per thread nowadaze...
<font color="#a52a2a" size="1">[ December 11, 2004 11:39 PM: Message edited by: LanDroid ]</font>
Posting Permissions
Bookmarks